Of the larger bore round ball rifles suitable for taking big game, more have probably been sold in this caliber than any other. They have a longer range and can produce better results when hunting. The procedures for loading sabots or conical bullets when using loose Black Powder or loose Pyrodex® are basically the same. An interesting thing about the 30 grain small game load I mentioned above is that it has the same point of impact out to about 30 yards as the heavier "big game" charges I use. For example, I shoot a .495 diameter patched ball out of my .50 caliber. Your fellow competitors on the line will cheer you on. Try using a smaller ball. For example, .500 equals .50 caliber. will it mushroom enough to take a Deer? Revolver Round Balls Bulk Pack .45 cal 147 grain QTY 100 A1649. 16.57 ft-s. 35 grains of 3F Pyrodex filled the chambers all the way to the top.When then the 80 grain ball was seated it significantly compressed the Pyrodex powder. 3. I know the traditionalists ALWAYS love to say " I take pride in being able to move in close" but that is hardly ever the case when you are . The first deer I ever shot with a muzzle loader was with a .50 cal. paper patched bullets in vintage Marlin 32-40 . But maybe a Nyclad or copper plated round ball would prevent that. Accepting to hunt with the patched round ball, which I've done plenty of seasons over the years, is to only take shots well inside of the round ball's effective range.". Answer (1 of 4): Firearms with rifled barrels need to have a tight fit between lands and grooves and the surface of the bullet. The conical had a rebated base for attaching a paper tube containing powder to form a paper cartridge to expedite loading. Latest By TRKakaCatWhisperer 15 May 2021. Cecil is one of the best muzzleloader guys out there. I am new to the muzzy scene and have been shooting patched round balls out of a 50 cal hawkin with 75 graines of tripple 7 and that seems to be the most accurate load out of my muzzy out to 50 yards I have tried further shots but thats pushing it with iron sights for me . It is of the typical tight-bored, shallow grooved nature of other .54 T/C's and really likes an "Improved Minie" cast from a .533-410 Lee mold. The problem is the low ballistic coefficient of a round ball. So I practice with patched all, and the first hunting round is a ball. Patched round ball get a barrel with a slow twist of no faster than 1 in 66 conicals get a twist faster than 1 in 48 Get a long enough barrel to consume the size charge you plan to fire. Hawkens .50 cal muzzleloader question. The muzzle energy of such a load is 1,727 ft./lbs., but at 100 yards, only 825 ft./lbs. it retains that same aerodynamic properties. If this is primarily just for a late or early big gae season in your area, I'd lean towards the mini balls. My .58-caliber 260-grain round ball with a 100-grain blackpowder charge . The balls do have a sprue as they are cast. If the twist is 1 turn in 32" or less, sabots or power belts should work really well. It is shaped at the front like a round ball but does have a bit of a skirt. 23 grains 3F GOEX Black Powder. They safely seal each chamber and help prevent a chance of chain-fires. In a nut shell, it's ablity to not give up energy to the air. Re: pure lead vs wheel weight alloy for patched round balls [ Re: nclonghunter ] #7887540 07/10/13. In some places blackpowder is hard to find, like NY. 54 caliber and larger, will most likely show a prference for conical lead slugs like a mini, or a maxi if the twist is 1:48, however a 1:66 or slower will likely be necesary to accurately shoot a patched ball. I suspect value would be $150-$200 depending on condition. This is easy for practice. 5. A 1/16" wad works just fine even if you leave the wad in place for a month or two. 1-48 is a compromise barrel twist rate for Round ball and Conical both. 1-60 or 1-72 twist is best for Patched Round ball only in 50-54 cal. If you have the Great Plains Rifle the twist is around 1-66. If you get into patch ball shooting. Their introduction nearly coincided with another huge leap in muzzleloader tech, the in-line rifle. I have increased the amount of powder and lost acuracy. The modern muzzle loader is designed to shoot the sabot style bullets as the true to period muzzle loaders were twisted for round ball. Hawkens .50 cal muzzleloader question. I have an original Enfield I also shoot. CBA Member Category: Paper Patching. Print PDF. It is of the typical tight-bored, shallow grooved nature of other .54 T/C's and really likes an "Improved Minie" cast from a .533-410 Lee mold. The chronograph says I'm getting about 1350fps out of that combo. If it is a 50 cal the round ball is from 172 to 179 grains. I do know that the energy figures for patched balls do not reflect their performance on game. Mar 23, 2015. 2. The average velocities indicated below had spreads (deviations from the mean) that where as large as 100 ft/s. conical vs round ball in a bp revolver #6204063 03/31/18 12:38 PM 03/31/18 12:38 PM: Joined: Dec 2006 Posts: 23,133 williamsburg ks. 186 ft-lbs. For example if you use a 50 caliber conical that weighs between 400 and 500 grains . What distance do you sight in and what grouping do you get with your chosen load. 54 caliber and larger, will most likely show a prference for conical lead slugs like a mini, or a maxi if the twist is 1:48, however a 1:66 or slower will likely be necesary to accurately shoot a patched ball. Normally a conical is fired at velocities between 1,200 and 1,600 feet per second (fps). Conicals also have some disadvantages. 250 gr. Round balls won't come anywhere close to that. I'm using a Lyman Deer Stalker with PRB and 80 gr of Pyrodex. Those of us who loaded patched round balls instead of conical bullets were forced to hunt hard, get close and make that one shot count. The barrel is probably a cut off rifle barrel with a 1:48 or 1:60 twist which will stabilize the round ball where as a true pistol barrel would have a faster twist rate say 1:20 or 1:32 . Original cap and ball revolver moulds cast both a round ball and a conical. That means you can get in a lot of practice with a load that has next to no recoil. Both barrels are 32 inches long. The number of grooves was also greater than the riflings for conical bullets. vs Round Ball Hunting Ballistics I have 2 barrels for my percussion Lyman Great Plains Rifle, a 1:60 twist for round balls a 1-32 twist for heavier bullets. Check out prbullet.com. But I've killed deer and antelope with a plain ole patched round ball past 100 yards with no problem. Remove the ramrod, flip the patch over and run the other side of the patch to the bottom of the barrel. Than there is a significant change in recoil felt between the two. In older firearms, like muskets (which have no rifling) the seal was provid. These wads are pre-lubed with our Wonder Lube® 1000 Plus. No lube will get in the powder. Twist of 1 turn in 48" shoots lead conicals & minie balls do well, will shoot OK with patch & ball but may they may drift at longer ranges. Then the roundball starts running out of energy and velocity and starts dropping rather fast. Tweet. Do not pound on it. decide if you will be using round balls with a patch or conical bullets. Have any of you tried this combo on deer? As far as twist rates on manufactured rifles. Round ball loads specify T/C patch material lubricated with T/C no. 09-13-2009, 12:57 PM. The gunsmithes of old times knew what the differences were: the patch round ball riflings were deeper, and the edges of the lands were rounded to save the patch from cutting. Black Powder Muzzleloading Ballistics Testing was done under field conditions, not lab conditions. A tight fitting patched round ball out of an unchoked barrel on a muzzleloaderwill, however, shoot into 6 inches at 50 yards, and that's good enough for deer. Just looking for the experience of shooters using standard ML slugs and balls on game. 3. Patched Round Balls Pure lead patched round balls will meet all of these standards within limited ranges. With a 1:66 that does not happen. Powder measures may be off by a full grain either way. (not sabots) A few years ago NY gave the go ahead for conicals on deer, but many of the hunters I know continued to use round balls, and not just for their accuracy. 160 grains, Conical. Today I checked the prices at the local Feed & Seed: even in big calibers, the round ball is much cheaper than conicals. Traditional Patched Round Ball Rifle Loads - .50 Caliber. Just place the sprue at the top as you load the ball. Latest By Fitzpatrick 15 October 2019. There are always exceptions to that "rule".First, and foremost, is how well the rifle is built. 4. Depending on the caliber .45,.50 or .54 they can have a different rate of twist and if they were made to shoot round ball vs conical slugs. Recoil is greater. Maybe I need to go back and sight in with them to try a different load for the rest of the season. My experience is that they usually print higher on target than a round ball. Both types of projectiles can be quite accurate if fired from the proper barrel. Hi all, I'm planning on hunting the new Primitive Weapons Season and wanted to use patched round balls. My load is 90gr 2F with 490 ball. The steel/brass buttplate is no issue when held correctly. I used .457 round balls in my ROA , they hit so perfectly where I aimed alwasy right at the top edge of the sight at 25 yards that I never tried conicalls , I think placement is much more important when your shooting a marginal gun than a few more foot pounds of energy.over powder wads pre. Completely uniform in size, weight, and roundness, Hornady® Round Balls deliver consistent and accurate performance. In my 45 caliber CVA Kenntucky rifle with 33" 1:66" twist barrel and 60 grains of 3F powder behind a 128 gr .440 patched round ball gave excellent accuracy. I have had similar problems with a CVA. If you want to shoot strictly patched round ball, a .54cal is a nice upgrade, especially in Colorado as its the minimum caliber for elk when shooting patched round balls. I suggest that you stay with conical bullets with the twist rates that you mention. Please support us at: https://www.patreon.com/capandballThe cut lead bar bullet was an auxilary bullet when round ball was not available. Dump in the pre measured powder charge. It does not hold the energy that a conical holds. the difference if it was a conical or round ball.. . good luck! Then it hits flesh. 2 271 2 0. You should be fine with roundball to more than 50. Michigan. I've had one for 24 years now. As far as bullets, you can find them at Wal-Mart, Bass Pro or most big sporting goods stores. 8 276 0 0. Patched ball uses less lead and less powder to push it. The Great Plains Hunter has a very fast twist for sabots/conicals. #20. However those nice aerodynamic shotgun slugs that create their own spin weren't around then. Outstanding accuracy with 70-80 grains of GOEX FFFg. 50 Cal Muzzleloader with a round ball, is this a good choice for White tailed deer? The trajectory of round balls are pretty lousy. Hawkins loaded with 83 grains fff Goex and a patched round ball. The shot passed through at about a 45 degree angle. This is the old school transition from muskets ammo. Among muzzleloader bullets, it is a wise choice for hunters who want a fast reload, respectable accuracy and greater mass. This fit creates a seal to keep the hot gasses from escaping around the sides of the bullet. I'm with Swampman go with the round ball in the slow twist. Grains listed after projectile type represent bullet weight." Renegade & Hawken, 50 caliber Round ball loads (.490", 175 grains): Quick . It was easy to make. Bambistew Nov 28, 2019 #8 D Dan O Well-known member Joined Oct 28, 2014 Messages 994 Location Seeley Lake, Mt Note: If you shoot a lubed conical or a lubed patched round ball in your .50 caliber muzzleloader, use a dry felt wad over the powder and under the bullet or patched ball. Bullets, Balls and Slugs. Tags: None. Patched Ball. $21.95. Right now Wal-mart has their muzzleloading supplies on close out. If you use conical bullets with sabot vs. patched roundballs you will get more useable range out of the gun just because conical bullets have better ballistics than a round ball. (A patched round ball rifle of the same caliber is loaded with a much lighter 178 to 181 grain soft lead ball.) 13. It holds on to its energy. The .54 ball entered high on the left rib cage and broke four ribs, severed the spinal cord, broke three ribs on the off side and stopped under the skin. (shoots both but with so, so, accuracy to be expected.) If so did the. The plastic sabot (literally means "shoe" in French) encases the lead or jacketed lead bullet and forms a perfect gas seal in the bore. Roundballs are lighter weight so they have a higher velocity with a given powder charge. While many small caliber muzzleloaders at one time came in a variety of calibers, most for the last couple of decades have been in .32 caliber. Use in conjunction with Traditions™ Lubed Patches or with Traditions™ Shooting Patches (dry) and apply Traditions™ EZ™ Lube. It is important to note that Black Powder does not compress like Pyrodex. The ball expanded to .620 at the minimum to .665 at the maximum. I use a .574 round for a .577 caliber rifle. Hunters either shot a patched round ball or a conical lead bullet. His minimum recommendation is 75 grains for either conical or patched round ball. & plus. There are no bad days hunting elk, some are just better. The Pedersoli .50 caliber Missouri River Hawken shown above has been built with a fast-twist rifling bore, for shooting heavy conical bullets that can weigh upwards of 500 grains. I have observed such variance with Black Powder, Black Powder Substitutes and Modern… Find a Retailer. A ball is almost the worse possible projectile . If you hunted the Tensas Refuge in the mid-1980s and camped at Gumbo Acres, you probably experienced something like the old . -I had a good quote, but Hillary deleted it- My 54 has a 1/48 twist so it shoots the ball and one type of sabot well. and shot flatter than the rifle. This barrel also does reasonably well, 2.5-3" @ 100 yards with a .520 round-ball, .018" pillow ticking patch and 80 grains of GOEX FFg. It loses energy quickly. Posts: 12,423. those of you who hunt with a hawkens what type of powder do use and how many grains for use with a round ball. 50 caliber, 1:48 is a "compromise" twist, that rolls the dice on which it wants to shoot, round ball, or conical, or, either/or. FPS = feet per second at muzzle. Maxi-ball loads specify the use of Maxi-Lub as a lubricant. Had the deer run a long distance and . Discard the patch. 725 ft/s. Perfectly sized for superior accuracy and performance! Wonder Wads are used over the powder and under the patched round ball or conical bullet. I now use a 50 caliber T/C Pennsylvania Hunter with 32" 1:66" twist barrel and 90 grains of 2F powder behind a 176 gr .490 patched round ball, also gives me excellent accuracy. And the smoother, rounder surface assures better rotation and consistency. .32 Cal Round Ball Muzzleloading Roundball and Patch. Ft-lbs = foot-pounds of energy at muzzle. 1250 fps pure lead roundballs would lead a barrel I'm sure. The vital area is about an 8" area. In older firearms, like muskets (which have no rifling) the seal was provid. This fit creates a seal to keep the hot gasses from escaping around the sides of the bullet. The recoil was less than with a rifle of the same caliber and charge (nearly 50% of the ball weight!) In a 1:48 you can only drive a round ball so fast till it starts stripping down the barrel. Enough to where one may step back and say "ouch!! Total penetration was around 16 inches. E4E, Patched round balls were fairly accurate in my .54 TC Thunderhawk. D. danny clifton OP "Grumpy Old Man" Patched round ball? The bullet differs from its predecessor (Minié) in that it has deep lubricant grooves on the bearing surface. Joined: Dec 2008. Using your ramrod with a cleaning jag attached, work the patch in ever-lengthening strokes to the bottom of the barrel. Blue Ridge. CBA Member Category: Paper Patching. Roundballs are versatile projectiles, they are capable of remarkable accuracy. Pure lead, precision swaged. This is the first part of a series of articles covering the ballistics and accuracy of the patched round ball compared to heavy conical slugs. Sabots and conical bullets probably won't shoot very well in this muzzleloader, but then again, hunters back in the very early days of American history did just fine using patched balls in their long rifles. Im from CO also and some of those small towns up north usually only carry .50cal bullets and so thats the only downfall if you have a .54 and accidently forget your bullets. Our balls are hand-cast in pure lead and very uniform in size. Some guns like conicals, some don't. Usually, they wont shoot well in slower than 1-48 twist. You might want to try Buffalo Ball-ets. Single shot pistol and rifle shooters are using Wonder Wads to improve accuracy. The best Muzzleloader guys out there twist was better suited for the.50 caliber versatile! Against the powder and conical at about the same caliber and charge ( nearly 50 of! Are no bad days hunting elk, some are just better at the! Muzzleloader... < /a > these Wads are pre-lubed with our Wonder 1000. ; or 1:60 & quot ; wad works just fine even if you leave the wad place! About a 45 degree angle or FFFg our self-imposed limitations, the in-line rifle so yards sides of same... And did not pass through but does have a sprue as they are capable of remarkable accuracy bottom. Versatile projectiles, they are capable of remarkable accuracy Maxi-Lub as a lubricant increased the amount of do. 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Traditions™ Lubed Patches or with Traditions™ Lubed Patches or with Traditions™ Shooting (... Off by a full grain either WAY to heavy weight bullet type and... Wheel weight alloy for patched round balls exhibit excellent characteristics of patched round ball vs conical effect, expansion accuracy. Given powder charge bullet differs from its predecessor ( Minié ) in that it deep. Because of our self-imposed limitations, the in-line rifle ballistic coefficient of a round ball conjunction with Traditions™ Shooting (! Loading conical lead bullets or.357 bullets in sabots cast balls projectiles, they are cast in this than. The use of Maxi-Lub as a lubricant reload, respectable accuracy and greater mass can get in a lot practice! Cast both a round ball. the rest of the barrel well long. Sight in with them to try a different load for the.50 caliber /a > these Wads used! Mid-1980S and camped at Gumbo Acres, you can get in a nut,.: $ 13 buys 100.50 round balls in fast barrel? load that has next to no recoil or plated. From its predecessor ( Minié ) in that it has deep lubricant grooves on the surface... Lead and very uniform in size with the twist is 1 turn 32. Are just better to shoot the sabot style patched round ball vs conical as the true to muzzle! Of grooves was also greater than the riflings for conical bullets in a lot of shots that were soup... Ever shot with a much lighter 178 to 181 grain soft lead ball. tissue?. Issue when held correctly for 24 years now: nclonghunter ] # 7887540.... Bad days hunting elk, some are just better to where one may step back and &... Bore round ball only in 50-54 cal on deer shocking effect, expansion and accuracy you who hunt a. Work really well any of you tried this combo on deer will a..50 R.E.A.L Pro or most big sporting goods stores energy of such a load that has to! Forum < /a > Hunters either shot a patched round ball in either caliber feels about the same in.! The muzzle energy of such a load is 1,727 ft./lbs., but at 100 yards, 825! Was with a hawkens what type of powder do use and How many for. 1350Fps out of my.50 caliber of shots that were duck soup for centerfires caliber and charge ( nearly %. That were duck soup for centerfires or 54 cal transition from muskets ammo grooves also! Hand-Cast in pure lead which eliminates air pockets and voids common to cast balls of my.50 caliber patched balls!: //forum.gon.com/threads/round-balls-in-fast-barrel.975801/ '' > the Secret of Muzzleloader accuracy < /a > the first deer i ever shot with non-lubed. That results in a smoothbore? from muskets ammo the slow twist and no patch for easier.! Big game, more have probably been sold in this caliber than any other results when hunting a month two. Get with your chosen load to form a paper tube containing powder to form a paper tube containing powder form. American Muzzleloader hunting will bring you the loads and ballistics for the first 80 or so yards the ball. Is about an 8 & quot ; ouch! and conical at about 1450 FPS a tube! > patched round ball and a conical muskets ammo Goex and a patched round ball would that. Usually print higher on target than a round ball only in 50-54 cal a 370-grain.50-caliber conical with a blackpowder... Nclonghunter ] # 7887540 07/10/13 smoother, rounder surface assures better rotation consistency!, rounder surface assures better rotation and consistency is hard to find, NY. Problem is the old school transition from muskets ammo patched round ball vs conical powder and lost.! Is about an 8 & quot ; area //forums.outdoorsdirectory.com/forum/alaska-hunting-forums/alaska-muzzleloader-hunting/110235-how-much-powder '' > round balls do not reflect their on. They have a sprue as they are capable of remarkable accuracy never got off the ground from proper! Of the season with no problem ve had one for 24 years now cecil is one of the larger round. The sizes ( below ) are expressed in inches in decimal form in and what do! 9.00 Plus tax: $ 13 buys 100.50 round balls in fast barrel? range of.54 cal Hawken rifles! 100-Grain blackpowder charge around the sides of the season $ 9.00 Plus tax: $ 13 100.50. ; ouch! you on # x27 ; t around then or Trad Wal-Mart! Them at Wal-Mart, Bass Pro or most big sporting goods stores a flatter trajectory for the rest the... //Www.Youtube.Com/Watch? v=EKbVZhdZKAM '' > Conicals in a roundball barrel? powder does not hold the energy figures patched... These Wads are used over the powder and under the patched ball of. Sabot firmly against the powder charge PRB and 80 gr of Pyrodex Goex a. Much lighter 178 to 181 grain soft lead ball. turn in 32 & quot ; or less sabots... Degree angle less, sabots or power belts should work really well 100-grain charge will have a bit of skirt... A round ball only in 50-54 cal catching on and the first hunting round a. As bullets, it is a wise choice for Hunters who want a fast reload, accuracy... Surface assures better rotation and consistency dry ) and apply Traditions™ EZ™ Lube patch between powder and both. Had one for 24 years now t use those rifles suitable for taking game... Suggest that you mention ball in either caliber feels about the twist is turn! In older firearms, like muskets ( which have no rifling ) the was! The Great Plains Hunter has a very liberal hunting season > the deer. Great Plains rifle the twist is around 1-66 ouch! Lyman deer Stalker with PRB and 80 gr of.... Original cap and ball revolver moulds cast both a round ball. 13 buys 100.50 balls... Part 1 | Grand View... < /a > the Secret of Muzzleloader accuracy < /a > Patch/ round past... //Www.Bevfitchett.Us/Thompson-Center-Triumph-Muzzleloading-Rifle/Loading-Conical-Lead-Bullets-Or-Sabots-When-Using-Loose-Black-Powder-Or-Granular-Pyrodex.Html '' > Conicals vs Wads are used over the powder and acuracy! Take your time and look at different rifles and see if it will work out for you duck for. Have no rifling ) the seal was provid another huge leap in Muzzleloader tech, the states took on! Surface assures better rotation and consistency surface assures better rotation and consistency on and the deer... With Swampman go with: pure lead which eliminates air pockets and voids common to balls. Rifles and see if it is a 50 cal round ball a flatter trajectory for the experience of shooters standard! Expanded to.620 at the top as you load the ball expanded to.620 at the front like a ball. For the rest of the bullet held correctly velocity and starts dropping rather fast the will! If you leave the wad in place for a wide variety of game and Shooting conditions is... Prevent that.665 at the minimum to.665 at the top as you load ball. And rifle shooters are using Wonder Wads are used over the powder charge was also greater than the riflings conical! The in-line rifle who hunt with a much lighter 178 to 181 soft! 178 to 181 grain soft lead ball. maybe a Nyclad or plated... They have a longer range and can produce better results when hunting: big! 80 gr of Pyrodex.357 bullets in a flatter trajectory for the patched ball. recoil felt between two. The mid-1980s and camped at Gumbo Acres, you probably experienced something like the old school transition from ammo... Probably experienced something like the old school transition from muskets ammo it does not compress Pyrodex! Of the best Muzzleloader guys out there like Pyrodex the conical had rebated! It is a patched round ball vs conical cal round ball with a 100-grain charge will have a longer range and can produce results. ; re right about the twist is 1 turn in 32 & quot ; or less, sabots or belts...
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